0:00Hi, everyone.
0:01Welcome back to the Change Your Mind podcast.
0:03I'm your host, Kris Ashley, where we explore the intersection between personal development, spirituality and science.
0:09And I'm really excited for my guest today.
0:12I, we we, we worked really hard to get her on the schedule.
0:17So I'm so excited to share it's all about chronic pain.
0:21But first a few quick announcements, head over to my website krisashley.net.
0:26All the links are in the show notes too.
0:28You can find information about my courses free workshops.
0:32I give online my book, Change Your Mind to change your reality and connect with me.
0:37I'm at change your mind with Kris all over social media.
0:40Hi, I'm Kris.
0:42When I was younger, I went through trauma that caused me to feel broken and lost.
0:46But my life changed after I had a spiritual awakening.
0:50Since then, I've dedicated my life to studying and learning from masters all around the world that have helped me to create a life of fulfillment and abundance beyond my wildest dreams.
0:59Now I'm dedicated to sharing everything I've learned so that you don't have to suffer for decades.
1:04Like I did.
1:05I've seen people's lives completely transform and I share it all right here.
1:11Now, I am so excited I have with me today, Petra Brun Bauer and Petra is a wellness coach, a podcast host and the creator of the Journey well well being program.
1:23So in 2019, she, she created the journey well-being program after a transformative personal experience, inspired her to continue her own journey of healing, self discovery and personal development in psychology and mental health.
1:38The journey offers a comprehensive online coaching program, podcast, blog, virtual summits and many resources to support individuals in their journey to become to better mental, physical and emotional well being as the host of the Journey podcast and writer of the journey blog.
1:55Petra shares her insights on holistic healing and mental health.
1:59Petra is also the host of the virtual Holistic well-being summit with over 40 expert speakers and I know you're in grad school right now.
2:07So you are one busy lady.
2:08I'm so honored that you made time.
2:10Welcome Petra.
2:12Thank you so much while I'm listening to you talk about the introduction.
2:17I'm just kind of thinking.
2:18Yeah, it's been a really busy year.
2:19So, but I've enjoyed it all.
2:22So definitely no complaints.
2:25Yeah.
2:26Yeah.
2:26And I I I cut out some parts but you, you moved to France from Canada and yeah, you're just, your story is awesome.
2:34And I'm really excited to talk about chronic pain.
2:36It's something that hits home.
2:37My listeners know my mother has lived with chronic pain for a very long time and I've done some research to try to help her if I'm Johnny Saros and some others.
2:46But you are just a wealth of knowledge and I cannot wait to get into this conversation.
2:51But I want to start off.
2:52I read it in your bio about a personal transformation that led to all of this.
2:57And I love hearing people's origin stories.
2:59So please share with us.
3:01What was your transformative personal experience?
3:05Yeah, absolutely.
3:07I think for most of us who end up in sort of a coaching or healing practitioner profession, there's always something that brings us to why we end up doing what we're doing.
3:17And it was the same for me.
3:20I, it started actually when I was a teenager, I had a lot of mental health struggles and just couldn't really find my place.
3:28I moved from Germany to Canada.
3:30That was the first move when I was a teenager.
3:32So that caused a bit of a identity problems and just kind of losing my whole world that I had known my friends, my family because we, we just moved into the middle of nowhere.
3:44So it started at that age just with a lot of issues that I just didn't know where I belonged.
3:51And I, I worked on that for a very long time which my twenties, my thirties, I kept looking for ways to feel happier, feel better.
4:01And my husband and I decided to move to France in 2017.
4:05So back across the Atlantic and in 2018, I had quite the horrible year.
4:11, several people in my family passed away.
4:15Also shortly before or after that, my best friend died of a heart attack in his late thirties.
4:22One of my friends passed away from breast cancer.
4:25And at the end of 2018, I was so drained and I remember just sitting in bed one night and I was crying and I'm like, I don't know who I am.
4:37I don't know where I belong.
4:38I, I just don't even know what's going on anymore.
4:41And I had such a tough year for and I couldn't even put my finger on it other than knowing that I felt so disconnected and so much pain and confusion.
4:53And and I said to my husband, I don't really know how to fix this.
4:57I don't even know where to start with all of this.
5:00But I think that many people feel like that and I should find something that helps people.
5:08So that very simple thing at the end of 2018 was what eventually led me to creating the journey and creating the journey podcast and certifying in a lot of different holistic modalities because I thought that I couldn't be the only person who was experiencing these kind of feelings on the planet.
5:31There had to be other people.
5:32And so I, I wanted to create something that could help people.
5:36That was the first step to it.
5:37And in,, 2020 I, I fell off a chair.
5:43So this was really nothing exciting.
5:45I fell off a chair and I broke my foot and I ended up in a cast and was told after six weeks, the cast would come off and I could drive again.
5:55Everything was fine.
5:55It was not a complicated break.
5:57I didn't need surgery or anything.
5:59So I wasn't a castle for Christmas, which really sucked.
6:04But between Christmas and New Year, they, they took the cast off and I couldn't walk.
6:11So they told me to come back, you know, three weeks later, they would reassess,, they did an X ray, everything looked fine, the bone had healed, everything was good, but the swelling didn't come down and, and I just couldn't walk.
6:23Every time I put my foot on the ground, I had excruciating pain.
6:26It was like flames shooting up my leg and everything was burning and I just, I couldn't walk.
6:32So I came back a few weeks later, they x rayed, they couldn't find anything.
6:38They said, you know, we, we need to start you on physiotherapy.
6:41So I started that, I went for about three months to March and I still couldn't walk and I was in a wheelchair by then because I just simply couldn't get around the house and trying to do chores and crutches at the same time was, was really complicated.
6:57So, yeah, they had,, sent me a wheelchair and I had physio 2 to 3 times a week, but the pain just didn't go away.
7:07And I used a wheelchair for about six months, which gave me a whole new understanding and appreciation of all of the challenges around when your mobility is impaired.
7:18And you,, I, I couldn't even go up the stairs to, to use the bathroom or I couldn't even stand in the shower.
7:26Like there were so many difficult things that happened because of that.
7:31I couldn't drive myself anymore.
7:32I kind of lost my independence because I couldn't just get in the car and go grocery shopping.
7:38So it was a very difficult time for me to think that in my late thirties that, that's what it would be like from now on.
7:46I couldn't do any sports or exercising.
7:49, there's a lot of castles here in France and I love exploring castles, but that just, it wasn't possible.
7:55I can't put the foot into a shoe.
7:58And at the end of the six months we, we got to a point where I could finally crutch around a little bit more and I could put one of those surgery boots on my foot.
8:10So at least I could,, have a, a sole that I could kinda hobble around on for going out.
8:16But the pain continued for,, for 33 years.
8:21Well, now it's three years, almost three years when I, when I broke my foot.
8:24So,, and it, it kind of started spreading my leg and eventually they, they diagnosed me with complex regional pain syndrome.
8:35And,, the, the answer was to just put lidocaine patches on it every night and, and that was it.
8:41So it was not very helpful.
8:44And that kicked off a journey of needing to find something that could help with this pain that could get me back to being active.
8:53I, I gained a lot of weight because I simply couldn't move very well.
8:57And that, yeah, that really, that was the second transformative piece that really kicked off my interest in chronic pain and anything related to that and things that could help.
9:09Wow, thank you so much for sharing those stories.
9:12And, you know, I, I think the first story is so many people can relate to, right?
9:18Because unfortunately, we all go through loss.
9:22That's part of this, this human experience and to lose friends at such a young age is like extra devastating.
9:30Absolutely.
9:31And to have it happen all at once, it kind of seems like it happens like that sometimes, right?
9:35Like when it rains, it pours, it's like a dark night of the soul.
9:39I had a similar thing where last year my, my dog passed away and then my dad passed away and like he was my best friend and it was just all like a long hospice journey.
9:47So I was like tearing up as you were talking because I was like, oh everything you're describing.
9:52I know that pain.
9:54But I think it is so powerful and so beautiful that at the end of that, even though you were emotionally drained and had been through so much, and I can't even imagine like multiple, multiple people that you lost out of your own pain.
10:07You wanted to help others who are suffering.
10:10And that's, that's so powerful because it's so easy to just go the other way, right?
10:15It's so easy to just fall into that state of despair.
10:19And it's hard to come out of it.
10:21You like, you really do lose your sense of identity when the real world comes crashing down around you like that.
10:28So I just wanna just highlight how beautiful and powerful that is that that's the realization you came to that you want to help others.
10:36And then for the, for the pain story, it it it's crazy.
10:40I feel like I've heard so many people have these similar reports that, you know, Western medicine is great if you break your arm or you're in a car accident, but it seems like they don't really know, you know how to help people, especially when it comes to chronic pain.
10:56Like you said, like lidocaine patches are not the answer and it's been three years.
11:01So So what did you end up finding and how are you doing today?
11:06Yeah.
11:06So my search continued and I came to the realization through various, I mean, there are so many books available and therapies available.
11:16But at, at some point, I came to the realization that there is a mind, body component to pain, at least for myself.
11:25And I don't know if that's true for everyone, but at least for myself that is something that I just discovered.
11:30So, the way that I took care of myself played into the pain, so not being able to exercise didn't help.
11:40I needed so much more rest.
11:43, rest was one of those things that I was such a, a busy person all the time.
11:48Like my calendar is always full, I'm always go, go, go.
11:52And after that happened, my body wouldn't function the same way anymore.
11:56And pain is really hard to modulate throughout the day.
12:01So if you're constantly busy throughout the day, managing your pain, it actually drains a lot of your energy.
12:08So part of what I came to realize is that I have to set very clear boundaries and how I take care of myself and be really honest when things become too much, even if other people think.
12:22Oh, well, you've just had a day off.
12:23How can you not be ready to do something?
12:25But they don't realize that a lot of the time with chronic pain, you actually spent the entire day fighting that pain just to get through the day, which is really exhausting at the end of the day.
12:36So there was, there was some of the self care pieces that I began to understand through the mind body connection.
12:43And the other piece that I realized pretty early on to is there's an emotional component to chronic pain, at least for myself.
12:53And that includes stress or any kind of emotions that affect you negatively.
12:59And so working on being able to better process emotions when they come up for me and also lowering stress levels has been huge.
13:10When I have a lot of stress.
13:12There is days where I just can't even put my feet on the ground in the morning because there's pain right away.
13:18So stress is a huge thing when it comes to chronic pain for myself.
13:23And so that the thing that I found actually was the most interesting and when we talked before, it's something definitely stay tuned on that one because I'm still working on it.
13:35But I discovered Doctor Bradley Nelson and it was really through a fluke that one of the people that I have gotten to know through the podcast mentioned him to me and I started looking into his books and what he offers.
13:52So he has written the emotion code and then also a follow up book called The Body Code.
13:59And you can certify in those modalities.
14:02And there are many practitioners that offer his way of, of working, not just with chronic pain, but really with, with anything.
14:11And the idea behind it is that most of the things that make us ill or uncomfortable or put us not at ease are caused by trapped emotions, emotional and traumatic events that happen in our lives that somehow become stuck in our body.
14:31They just didn't process and leave for whatever reason they stuck around in our bodies and then begin causing problems.
14:40And those can be mental emotional problems, it can be physical problems.
14:44Really trapped.
14:45Emotions can be involved from what I understand in many, many different things.
14:51And so this was my first aha moment when I was reading about the emotion code and I thought to myself, yeah, if you think back to all of the things that happened in the past few years and even decades back of emotional and traumatic events, this makes so much sense on, on why I'm feeling this pain and why it's not moving on because I haven't processed or released any of these emotions.
15:20And sure I worked with yoga, I worked with meditation.
15:24I worked a lot on stress reduction, but nothing specifically on releasing trapped emotions in that sense.
15:32So, so that's been, I think sort of the, the biggest and most impactful discovery that I've had in the last three years is working with, with the emotion code and learning about that at this point, I'm so glad you brought this up because it's something I write about in my book that, I mean, I haven't studied nearly to the extent that you have.
15:52But, you know, pain and illness can be messages from our body, right?
15:57That something is out of alignment that we're not following the path we're meant to, that we haven't processed something and so much of it comes from repressed emotions and there's, you know, I mentioned Johnny Saros earlier.
16:08He says a very similar thing.
16:10He, he focuses mostly on rage, like unexpressed rage.
16:13But I, I've noticed that in my own life too.
16:17I had chronic headaches for so long.
16:19And then I finally realized they were from stress and from like everything else in my body tensing up and it just happened to present that way because it's because the other thing that's fascinating is pain doesn't originate in the body part that you feel it, right?
16:33It's in your brain and nervous system, which is just like such a mind trip.
16:37Ok?
16:37So I have not read the emotion code or the body code.
16:40So I'd love for you to tell us a little bit more about what they are and, and what you're learning.
16:45And I know you told me before that you're not allowed to teach any of it.
16:48So tell us as much as you're allowed to because I think sometimes just hearing that this is a possibility can help so many people, right.
16:56Just having that realization and you know, the amazing thing about it is that any of the listeners can just go and purchase the book or the audio book and they can apply this themselves right away when they're reading the book.
17:11So they actually don't need to do a certification course.
17:15If they don't want to, they don't have to do anything.
17:16They could just get the book, read it and do it for themselves.
17:19So I love that.
17:21It's simple.
17:21It's very easy to read and understand.
17:24And so any of the listeners, if this is something they might want to try, just go out, download the audible or buy the book off of Amazon, read it and, and just do it, try it on yourself and, and see what happens.
17:36You know, that's how simple it is.
17:38So it is based on, on the assumption that because as human beings, we are all energetic beings, we're all made up of energy, we have vibrations, we have frequency and all of the emotions vibrate at certain frequencies as well.
17:58And so the emotion code specifically goes on the premise that when these events happen where we're vibrating at these very low frequencies, such as as pain and anger, shame, guilt, like those vibrate at very low frequencies that that actually in these events can cause our organs to take on those frequencies and then they can turn into thoughts and they can then affect our behaviors.
18:27And so that kind of turns into that whole cycle of emotions actually affecting every bit of our body through frequency and through vibration.
18:38And so, like I said before, when we have these events and sometimes we have traumatic events and our body just processes them.
18:47We're able to go through, let them go.
18:51We're able to maybe get some exercise, shake it off, you know, and move on.
18:56But very often these emotional events will actually stay in our bodies.
19:01They become stuck in there and they become stuck in the cells of our body and then they begin causing problems.
19:10And so the emotion code then goes on the premise that we can through muscle testing.
19:17So through speaking with our subconscious mind that we can discover whether or not we have these trapped emotions where they are in our body and what what those emotions are so that they can be released.
19:33And this again goes on the premise that the subconscious mind really is aware of anything and everything that has happened through our lifetime, that the subconscious mind really, it knows every traumatic event we've had, it knows every emotion we have felt, it knows which emotions were related to which event, which memories are related to that and that we can use the subconscious as sort of this really vast resource to discover where our trapped emotions are and then bring them to the awareness of our conscious mind.
20:08And through that release them.
20:11So it's, it's a very simple procedure.
20:14If you, if you think about it, it's very simple approach, but it's so profound.
20:19And the results of that, speaking to other people who work with the emotion code and the body code have been life changing for many people.
20:29You know, it it so I had so many thoughts come up as you were talking.
20:33The first is when you mentioned their association, their association with organs, different emotions that made me think Chinese medicine immediately, right?
20:41Like anger and Chinese medicine is associated with like the liver and gallbladder, grief with the lungs.
20:46And then I also started thinking about David Hawkins.
20:49I don't know if you've read his book Letting go the pathway of surrender.
20:52But he, he also characterizes emotions on different frequencies and he actually numbers them.
21:00It's like, I don't know, like I'm totally like making up the numbers but it's like anger is negative 500 joy is positive 200,000 like whatever it is.
21:10And his whole thing is it's really similar.
21:12He's like you have to release your repressed emotions.
21:15And I love that book.
21:16But I, I left being like, how you know, like, how do we do this?
21:21And I'm gonna ask you that in a second, but I have to say it is so cool that in the emotion code, the author gives you a way to test if you even have repressed emotions and where they're located like that's, that's like groundbreaking and my mind is blown hearing that.
21:40And muscle testing is such an easy thing to do and I'm sure he explains a certain way to do it.
21:45I've done it with a chiropractor before, but for listeners who don't know what muscle testing is, can you just give a quick explanation of what that is and how it works?
21:54.
21:55So the way that it's explained by Doctor Bradley Nelson is that your body or your subconscious can speak through the body, you can ask it questions and it always innately knows the answer.
22:13And some muscle testing can be used to ask certain questions and the subconscious will indicate with certain movements and there's different ways to muscle test.
22:24So one of them is the sway test where you sway forward for yes, sway backwards for no.
22:31And you can read this up in the book for the instructions and why and how this works.
22:37But it's basically tapping into the subconscious, having it speak through certain movements of your muscles or your body to indicate a yes or no response to what you're asking.
22:50So if you're asking your subconscious, for example, do I have a trapped emotion, then you can use the muscle test to find out yes or no from a very kind of intuitive place in your body.
23:05So without having to consciously go back through the last 3040 years that you've been alive trying to figure this out.
23:11But you can go directly to the subconscious and let it indicate what the answer to that is.
23:18And you can muscle test at different ways.
23:20There's tests that you can do for yourself.
23:23There's ways that you can test when you're working with other people.
23:26So there's different kind of ways and I'm sure that if people aren't able to do, for example, the way test, I mean, if you have mobility issues, it might be difficult to stand up.
23:36For example, there's many different ways that you can muscle test.
23:40So, out of all of those, I'm sure that listeners will find one way that works for them.
23:45And I know that some people use a pendulum to write like to kind of indicate a yes or no.
23:52It's all about connecting to the subconscious and just letting it give you that answer to the question that you're asking.
24:00And again, this is not really a new or revolutionary idea because even in hypnotherapy, we, we use those kind of techniques and in, in different other approaches, they use muscle testing and, and homeopathy, I think we use muscle testing as well.
24:18So it's, it's not a, a new thing but in the way that it's being used to discover these trapped emotions.
24:26I think it's quite revolutionary.
24:27And I, I asked Doctor Bradley that on the podcast, I'm like, why is this not more widely known?
24:34This is such an amazing approach why, why isn't everyone talking about this?
24:39Yeah.
24:40I, I'm so excited about it.
24:42I, like, I'm, like, over here eeking out and I'm like, as soon as we're over, I'm gonna buy these books because it, like, ok, so I am someone who has tried, like, so many healing modalities, you know, and I'm sure you have too, like, and there's so many that are, like, release, you're trapped emotions, right?
25:02And there's so many, I, I don't know, I'm thinking of like E MD R or hypnosis or meditations where it's like you're, you're actively trying to go figure out what emotions are trapped and what memories led to the trapping and like what you were feeling at that time.
25:20And you know what I mean?
25:21It's like you're like digging for the answers.
25:24But this is just like you said, it's like revolutionary, like the way that it's being used where you can actually just ask your subconscious and get a straight up yes or no.
25:33And then it's like, it's like, I feel like people could bypass years of therapy and like, I love therapy.
25:38Like everyone should go to therapy.
25:39But like, that's amazing.
25:41I, I like, I just think this is the coolest thing ever.
25:44And I can't believe that I didn't know about it and I'm so excited you're telling me about it.
25:48I know and I didn't know about it either.
25:50So I was very grateful to my friend who told me about that because I still probably wouldn't know about it.
25:56And I was just wondering why people aren't talking about this more.
26:01But I mean, there's also a change that is needed in the medical system in general that we need to integrate more with holistic approaches.
26:11We need to integrate more with sort of a whole body approach.
26:14And I think what Doctor Nelson is offering could be part of, of that change, you know, it could be part of just looking at healing in a very different way.
26:26But it'll take time, you know, it'll take time to become mainstream.
26:30Yeah, I mean, and I don't wanna get too deep into, you know, it's not a conspiracy theory but too deep into it.
26:36But, you know, unfortunately, pharmaceutical industries rule medical and they're the ones helping train all these doctors and so many doctors just don't know.
26:45Right.
26:46They're just not being taught about this kind of stuff in medical school and most of them are so busy that they're not going out and doing this kind of research themselves.
26:55OK, so, so we know that repressed emotions can cause pain, we know how to figure out if you have those repressed emotions using the muscle testing.
27:08So then how do we release them once we, once we have that confirmation that we have them?
27:14Yeah.
27:14So it's related, I believe to, you know, the because your body is, is a magnetic field.
27:21So it's all to do with the energy and the frequencies in your body.
27:24Really, it it has a magnetic field which now has been proven by science.
27:28Also, we can measure those things now, whereas we used to just kind of think that was there, but now we know it is so the way that emotions can get released, at least the first way that that I read about in the book and, and the training that I started, you can use a magnet to do that and you can also use your hands because your hands have electromagnetic fields as well.
27:55It's kind of the same idea when we do Reiki, for example, we're using the hands to move or change the energy when we're doing tapping like E F T tapping.
28:06For example, we're using our hands to kind of move energy and it, it works the same way in that idea.
28:14So I have read both about using magnets.
28:17I've read about just people using their hands to help with that to move the energy.
28:23So there's, there's different approaches, but none of them are outlandish or expensive.
28:30So you can definitely, if you have a fridge magnet that'll do, you can try it.
28:36So it's, it's really straightforward if you wanted to try that on yourself.
28:43OK.
28:43So how would you use a magnet?
28:45Is this one of the things you're allowed to talk about?
28:48I, I think listeners should probably read in the book for the exact way.
28:53But you're using a magnet to just affect the, the field, the electromagnetic field, right?
28:59So you're just moving it in a certain way in a certain direction.
29:04So if they, if they look in the book and, and there's charts on the book also that will help you determine, you know, which emotion it is that is trapped.
29:14And so that you can work more precisely with that.
29:17But again, you don't have to have any special skills.
29:20You don't need to be trained in any specific things.
29:24You don't have to be a yoga instructor or anything.
29:26You can just pick up a fridge magnet that you have at home and you can do this on yourself.
29:33You can test it out and see how it works for you.
29:37That's so amazing.
29:38I can't wait to read this book.
29:39And you were, when you first said magnet, I was thinking of like, you know, in the like cartoons, like, I think like Tom and Jerry, they have the like huge, like horseshoe shaped magnets.
29:48And I'm like this powerful thing and you're like, oh this a fridge magnet, that's pretty amazing.
29:53And it, it's, you know, I love backing things up with science and just the fact that we are manipulating this electromagnetic field is, is just so amazing.
30:05You know, it's, and the fact that we can measure it, like I keep saying this, but I feel like we are living in the most exciting time ever to be alive when science is backing up all of this holistic practices and spirituality and, you know, things that ancient cultures have been saying forever.
30:22It's just so, so cool and so exciting.
30:24It's not woo woo anymore.
30:25Right?
30:26It's not taboo.
30:27It's, it's science backed, which brings me to heart math.
30:31You know, I know, you know, quite a bit about heart math and that's all about, you know, measuring the the field around your heart, right?
30:39So can you talk to us a little bit about heart math?
30:42Yeah.
30:42Heart Roth was another really interesting discovery.
30:46I did just a very basic training with them this summer was eight weeks in length.
30:52And I learned about the heart brain coherence and how that affects us and and why we should be in heart brain coherence throughout the day because I guess that's a bigger question like why should we even do that?
31:05And again, it has to do with just optimizing how you live throughout your day, throughout your life.
31:14Because when the heart and the brain are in coherence and they can measure this.
31:21I mean, if you were to hook up a bunch of electrodes, you can measure brainwaves and you can do the same for your heart, you can measure the electrical impulses.
31:29And so when we achieve coherence, so that the brain waves get very similar to the heart waves, we are aligned, so to speak our minds and our bodies are then living in alignment and very simply put this, this helps boost our immunity.
31:51It helps us focus better.
31:53It helps us stay in a place where we're not expanding energy throughout the day.
31:58On negative feelings, negative emotions always feeling like we're fighting upstream.
32:04We are in essence entering a, a sort of flow state with the heart brain coherence and heart math has done so much research on that and you can definitely read up many, many studies that they have done and and how they're proving that this exactly works.
32:23But the basis of it all is that you want to learn how to achieve that heart brain coherence throughout the day.
32:30So that when you have experiences through the day that really rattle you or they make you angry or they put you in a place where you're just feeling misaligned, you've lost that center, then you have techniques that you can put yourself back into that flows suit into that alignment and that they have proven all sorts of impacts on health and mental health, physical health.
32:53So there definitely is a a large body of science to actually talk about why we should be doing this for our health and how that helps us.
33:02So especially when it comes to chronic pain.
33:06Heart Math offered techniques where I could and I had a lot of pain throughout the day, I could use the breathing techniques and I could use their techniques to to just realign myself and manage that pain a lot better.
33:22I wasn't coming so much then from a reactive space where I'm reacting to the pain, but I was putting myself into a state throughout the day that helped me manage it a lot better and, and stay in a much more aligned space.
33:36So I think heart math can be e everybody should be doing heart math.
33:41But it's one of those things that it's, it's so simple.
33:44You know, you use some breathing techniques and you use the coherence approaches, but it has such a profound effect on your health and on your life.
33:53And I don't know why more people aren't doing it so totally.
33:58And it, it only takes like a few minutes to get into coherence.
34:01Right.
34:02Yeah, that's really cool that they have stuff specifically for chronic pain.
34:07Like I've, I've used heart math.
34:09I have on my shelf, their little thing that puts onto your ear and then it like its just your, your phone and I've done that and it's cool.
34:17It's like you, you watch this Mandala and you breathe with it and then it like shows you when you're in coherence and it's, it was like a couple 100 bucks, but there's like a app that goes with it.
34:26And then I've been in workshops with like Greg Braden where he walks you through certain heart math stuff and when he does it, he has, you actually talk to your heart and you get these like instant answers and that are like, so powerful and I've, I've used it in like, those kind of ways and I've seen like Joe dispenser stuff.
34:46I know he does a lot with them but I, I haven't heard about it for chronic pain, which makes total sense.
34:53Right.
34:53It's everything we were saying because like, stress can create so much pain and it can worsen everything that you have.
35:00So it's really, really powerful.
35:03Heart math is so so cool.
35:06I love, I remember, I think they said that they measured like an 8 ft field from your heart to correct me if it's the wrong number.
35:15And they were like, and by the way, that's just as far as their measuring tools went, like it's, it's probably so much bigger.
35:22So, so, and I think that's, that's why a lot of people get affected by other people, right?
35:28Because so when you are walking into a room and there's somebody who maybe just had a really bad day or they're very angry because that field extends out really far.
35:38You actually cross into that field of many other people whenever you're in a crowd or when you're walking.
35:44So it also gives you techniques and skills to kind of you know, protect your own energy so that you're not picking up all of the stuff from everyone else around you because it's not always positive when you go out and you meet with other people.
36:00So I think that's also if you do have chronic pain, one of those things is really self regulation also.
36:08And that's a very, very great technique for helping with your own, protecting your own energy throughout the day as well.
36:17So important, I love that you said that and we, I feel like in a lot of New Age conversations or spiritual conversations or even just like memes on Instagram, people are like, OK, especially for empath, protect your own.
36:30But that's such a out there in the cloud kind of statement, but you just brought it back to earth and science back.
36:36So I think that's really cool.
36:38And it again makes me think of like Joe dispenser workshops where everyone is doing these meditations together and then their, their fields are all crossing and it's like magnifying.
36:50So it's like if everyone's aligned and it makes me think of the square root of square root of 1% where all these meditators went to DC.
36:57And I think it was like the nineties where it was like the crime capital of the world and they meditated on peace and it lowered all the violent crimes.
37:06Like it's amazing what we can do as a collective when we get together, right?
37:11But I love that you said protect your own energy too.
37:14OK.
37:14So you also mentioned another way to release depressed emotions is tapping and I haven't had anyone on the show talk about tapping yet.
37:22So if you could explain to listeners what is tapping and how does it work?
37:26Yeah, for sure.
37:27So the emotional freedom techniques or E F T as a known tapping, you literally are tapping on your body.
37:38So it was developed, I think in the 19 nineties by Gary Craig and he actually built on a lot of the earlier work from Doctor Roger Callahan, he created the thought field therapy, which is kind of the foundation for E F T tapping.
37:55And the premise I think for doctor Callahan was that he was integrating Chinese medicine principles with psychology.
38:04So using the energy points that Chinese medicine has known about for thousands of years and that they're using with acupuncture, acupressure those points, using them and integrating them in his practices to help release energy to help move energy and not all tapping, releases things.
38:26But sometimes it can move energy that's stagnant or it can move energy forward, that was running backwards or energy backwards, that was running forward.
38:34So optimizing the energy flow in your body so that you can heal from whatever it is that you're seeking healing from.
38:44And I found E F T again, really simple to do because you, you learn the tapping points and then you can do that any time in your home or wherever you are.
38:56So you don't need to have any big machinery or specialized equipment or anything to do that.
39:01And you can also, if you want to work with a practitioner, they could just make you a video that you use or write out, you know, some points for you, but you can do all of this yourself.
39:12And that's how I started off as well.
39:15I just went on youtube and I looked it up and I started using it for myself before certifying as a practitioner later on.
39:23But that's how simple some of these approaches are and yet they are so life changing and so profound and have really, really great results.
39:31And E F T is another one of those approaches that is science backed.
39:36And they have done many, many studies, I think that E F T International with Doctor Dawson Church, I think they did many studies over the years and they work with the VA I think for releasing PTSD in, in military personnel.
39:55So they've had really great success with many different illnesses or complaints that people have had and challenges they've dealt with.
40:03So the U F T again is another science backed method and I like science backed.
40:09So I like seeing the science on those things.
40:12But yeah, really simple to use.
40:15And you learn how to just use phrases and tap on points at the same time.
40:21And through that you're managing, you can manage chronic pain, you can release things for a lot of people tapping is very quick.
40:32So you do a session, you come in, maybe the pain is about a seven or eight out of 10.
40:38You do a session, maybe it goes down to three or four.
40:40You do another round and then it's zero or one.
40:43So I found that tapping is also, it, it works for, for myself.
40:48At least it works very quickly.
40:50So I don't need 20 sessions to, to fix something.
40:55It works fairly quickly for myself.
40:57So that's amazing.
40:59I mean, it's incredible that there's something out there that science back that you can do on your own that doesn't cost you any money that doesn't take a long time and the mainstream medical world doesn't even know about it.
41:13OK, so before we pressed record, you offered to walk listeners through a little tapping session.
41:21So I, I would love it if you could do that.
41:23I'm, I'm excited to try it myself.
41:26Yeah, for sure.
41:27We can do sort of the, the short version of it and listeners can also look online and they can learn more expanded versions of it or more specific to whatever it is that they wanna address.
41:41But the very basic premise of it is that you're gonna be tapping on different points on the body.
41:47And the first point that we start off is actually here on the side of the hand and it's just in that fleshy bit where when you're kind of going along, there's a fleshy part right here.
42:00And when you're tapping, you can use two fingers or four fingers or you can kind of make like a point and tap.
42:06It's whatever feels best for you.
42:09And it's the same with the tapping, strength, tap, sort of whatever feels good for you.
42:15I mean, you don't wanna be causing bruises and just hammering on the skin.
42:19But, but if you're just stroking very gently, it might not move the energy enough.
42:24So, so tap it in a way that feels comfortable and good for yourself so that you're not injuring yourself, but you can feel that you're affecting the energy in your body.
42:34And so when we start off tapping, we usually make a sentence that kind of guides the tapping session.
42:41And so if you're using chronic pain, for example, I don't even really need to know what that person's specific chronic pain is or what their specific trauma is or their specific illness or injury.
42:57The neat thing about tapping is that again, it works with the subconscious mind.
43:01So when you give it that prompt, the subconscious mind knows exactly what it is that you're trying to do.
43:09So it will work on that.
43:11So when we say today, for example, we can just say this problem or we can say this pain and listeners can substitute what it is exactly for them that they'd like to work on.
43:23So my foot pain or my arm pain my leg pain, or my sadness, my depression, my anxiety, you can just insert whatever it is that you're working on.
43:34So we usually start off here on this point and we'll just start tapping on the side of the hand.
43:40Does it matter which hand we start with?
43:43No, and you can do this left side, right side.
43:45When we come to the points on the face, you can do it on one side, you can do it on both sides.
43:50Whatever feels good for you, it will work either way.
43:54So even if you have a mobility challenge, you can only use one hand that's totally fine, it'll still work.
44:00So yeah, and then we usually start off.
44:04We, we make a sentence.
44:05So how do we do the sentence?
44:07Yeah.
44:08Yeah.
44:08So it'll be even though I have this pain and again, you insert, you know what it is that you have, even though I have this pain, we say that louder in our head.
44:18You can say it in your head when you're doing it yourself.
44:21When I'm working with someone, I will say it and then they usually will repeat it.
44:25So I, I give them little chunks to repeat while we're going.
44:28But if you're doing this at home, you can say it out loud, you can say it in your head, whatever works for you.
44:35So I can break it down into junks.
44:37And for this, it would be even though I have this pain, even though I, I completely love and accept myself completely love and accept myself.
44:51And if you don't believe that if you don't love and accept yourself, then you can also say, and I accept that or I am ok or I am open to discovering or I'm open to releasing this.
45:06So if you feel like you don't love and accept yourself, then you can change that as well.
45:11So we say that sentence three times.
45:14So even though I have this pain, even though I have this pain, I deeply and completely love and accept myself, I deeply and completely love and accept myself, even though I have this pain, even though I have this pain, I deeply and completely love and accept myself.
45:34I deeply and completely love and accept myself.
45:38So from here, we're gonna go to the inside of the eyebrow and you can do this both side, one side, one finger, two fingers.
45:48However, you wanna do that, the important thing is that you're just tapping on this energy.
45:53And as we're tapping here, we're just going to repeat the major part of the sentence we constructed, which is this pain because we are wanting to resolve the pain.
46:04So we just say this pain, this pain, let me tap about 5 to 7 times and then we'll go to the outside of the eyebrow just at the end of the eye here, we'll tap there and we'll repeat the same thing, we'll say this pain, this pain and then we'll go under the eye, we'll tap here and we'll say this pain, this pain and where, what are these points correlated to these currently to Chinese medicine points?
46:38So, the one that you're tapping on right now is that, I think it's the stomach point.
46:43, there's also a kidney point down here by the co point, bow and there's spleen point on the side, which will tap later.
46:50So they correlate to different energy meridians in your body.
46:55Sometimes they're along the meridian, sometimes they're the beginning or end points of those meridians.
47:00And so you can get into more of the Chinese medicine part if you want to know more about the points.
47:06But basically, that's what they correlate with when you're tapping them, their, their energy meridian points.
47:13Yeah.
47:14And then you tap under just under the nose here where that little divot is above your lip.
47:20You might have to stretch a little bit and you tap there and you say this pain, this pain.
47:30And then we'll go just here on the divot between the lip and the chin tap here and say this pain, this pain.
47:42And then we'll go down to the, where the collarbone comes together.
47:45There are sort of these two soft spots on either side and they might be a little bit sore, but they're like these soft divit.
47:53So when you follow the collarbone right to down here and then you go about an inch below that you'll feel there's these two divis that you come into.
48:03And so we're gonna tap on those.
48:05Yeah, they, they're also called the sore spots.
48:08So they usually are sore on people.
48:11Yeah.
48:12So you could tap those and you say this pain, this pain, you can also massage those if it feels better to not thump on them, but to just rub them, you can also do that.
48:25And then we're gonna go under the arm and we're coming down to roughly about where the bra strap sits and we're gonna tap there and we're gonna say this pain, this pain and then we'll go to the head and you can kind of make like, I don't know if you know those massage things that have like these different fingers.
48:50Oh my God.
48:51I love those kind of make a hand like that.
48:54And you can tap, there's many points on the top of the head.
48:58So I like to just kind of gently tap them all.
49:00So you can tap the top of your head and just say this pain, this pain.
49:09And once we're done here, we're gonna go back to the inside of the eyebrow and we're gonna repeat.
49:15So we're gonna start here again.
49:17OK.
49:18Now you're gonna say this pain, this pain and then out here this pain, can I switch sides?
49:27Absolutely.
49:28OK.
49:28Yeah, your body knows what you need.
49:30So you can, you can do either side, you can switch it up and you can do both.
49:35Yeah, whatever works and the bottom just below your eye.
49:40This pain pain under the nose, this pain, this pain and then the chin, the pain, the pain in the collarbone spots again and again, just thump them, rub them, massage them, whatever feels good.
50:07Listen to your body and what it tells you and this pain, the pain.
50:16Yeah, where the bra strap is.
50:19Again, this pain, this pain and then we repeat one more time.
50:28We do three in total for this.
50:30Ok?
50:30We go back to here this pain, this pain outside the eye, this pain, this pain under the eye, this pain, this pain under the nose, this pain, the pain and Chen the spain spain collar bones or spots this pain, the pain and then back to where the bra stops that's under your armpit, this pain, this pain.
51:22And by the way, if you're listening to this on the podcast, this is also on youtube.
51:25If you want to actually watch and follow along, see what we're doing and we'll go up to the head in this pain.
51:34This pain.
51:37So after three rounds, I'll take a really deep breath in through the nose and I'll help them out.
51:49And at this point, you can assess where you're at for whatever issue you were tapping on.
51:55So if you had foot pain, for example, and you tapped on foot pain then you check in.
52:01It's really nice.
52:02If before you start, you actually write down your number where you feel you're at from 1 to 10 because then you can look at what you wrote down because many times after you do the rounds, you don't really remember what the pain level you started with was.
52:16So it's nice to write it down and just give yourself a number, do the three rounds and then see where you're at.
52:22And usually we would continue the tapping rounds until the pain goes down, you know, to a zero or the feeling or the emotion or whatever it is that you're challenged with goes down to a zero.
52:33And this isn't the only tapping technique.
52:36There's other things that you do as well that we can use when the emotions don't move or when the pain doesn't move.
52:42But this is a basic sort of short tapping recipe that really anyone can just try in the comfort of their own home.
52:50Ok.
52:50So I have to tell you I was in a lot of pain.
52:54I'm I'm seven months pregnant and I've been in like some crazy pain on my ribs and like across my back for the last three months.
53:02And that, that like definitely helped it like it lowers the amount of pain.
53:07So that, that was really cool to see that happen in real time.
53:10So, yeah, thank you so much for sharing that.
53:14I can't believe an hour has passed already.
53:17, you know, is just, is there anything else that you want people to know that we didn't cover yet today?
53:25Like, is there any other message that you want to get out there?
53:29I think it's just really important that you advocate for yourself.
53:33There's no one that will do it for you.
53:35And that's what happened in my journey as well as if I didn't go out and look for it myself.
53:42Nothing would have changed really.
53:44But I would still be sticking a lot of came patches on my foot.
53:46I'm sure.
53:47So, it's so important to advocate for yourself and find the solution that works for you because from my experience, there are hundreds or even thousands of approaches out there.
53:59And usually there will be one that will give you some relief or will even help you entirely with your pain.
54:06So just keep looking, keep researching, keep trying different things and really advocate for your own health thing.
54:14That's the most important thing.
54:16I've learned such an important message.
54:18It's it.
54:19You have to.
54:20Unfortunately, you have to.
54:23So thank you so much.
54:25I'm sure Petra, you're amazing.
54:27I'm so glad you came on the show.
54:28I knew this episode was going to be phenomenal.
54:30It, it totally was.
54:32And I'm sure everyone wants to know how they can get in touch with you if they want to work with you, how they can find you.
54:39So if you wouldn't mind just letting listeners know all that.
54:42Yeah, absolutely.
54:42We've put everything actually in one place.
54:44So it's just bio dot the journey dot com and the journey is J O R N I and everything that we offer at that link.
54:55So it's nice and simple and you can check there for, for all the things that we offer.
55:00And I'm a little bit tied up still until the end of 2023 with finishing my dissertation.
55:08But as of January 2024 I'm hitting the ground running and we're going to offer some new programs and different coaching techniques and things that people can check out.
55:18So next year will be very, very exciting.
55:21Exciting things are coming to the journey.
55:23Awesome.
55:24And I'll have that link in the show notes too in case anyone's driving, I can't write it down.
55:29Awesome.
55:30Well, thank you so much.
55:31This was such a pleasure.
55:33Listeners again, head over to the show notes for everything on Petra.
55:38For everything on me.
55:39You can find my book, change your mind and change your reality on Amazon Google Apple and ebook, audio book, paperback, and lots of free resources on my website as well.
55:52Thank you so much.
55:53Everyone have a beautiful rest of your day and I'll see you next time.
55:57Thank you.