0:00Hi everyone.

0:01Welcome back to the Change Your Mind podcast.

0:03I'm your host,K
ris Ashley.

0:05As always, we explore personal development, spirituality and science.

0:09Today we are going to talk about a subject that is like so relevant to me, prenatal and postpartum fitness and body image.

0:16the first couple of quick announcements.

0:18If you head to the links in the show notes, you're going to find a lot.

0:21You'll find a link.

0:22To sponsor the podcast, you'll find a link to my book Change Your Mind to Change Your Reality.

0:28It was endorsed by Marc Shimoff, Bob Doyle, Michael Beckwith, all of whom were on the Secret.

0:32It was endorsed by John Gray, who wrote Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, a lot of others.

0:37You will find my free masterclass, you will find free downloads, you'll find my course, and private coach.

0:45And as always, this podcast is part of the Los Angeles Tribune podcast network.

0:50We do a lot in personal development.

0:52We have some amazing events going on with some huge headliners.

0:55We're just doing.

0:57I was just on a stage with Les Brown and Sharon Lecter and Dr.

1:01Joe Vitale from The Secret.

1:02So there's so much going on.

1:04Please, please tune in.

1:05Hi, I'm Kris.

1:07When I was younger, I went through trauma that caused me to feel broken and lost.

1:11But my life changed after I had a spiritual awakening.

1:15Since then, I've dedicated my life to studying and learning from masters all around the world that have helped me to create a life of fulfillment and abundance beyond my wildest dreams.

1:24Now I'm dedicated to sharing everything I've learned so that you don't have to suffer for decades like I did.

1:30I've seen people's lives completely transformed, and I share it all right here.

1:37OK, so with me today, I have Tara De Leon.

1:42So Tara is a professional trainer, professor of health, fitness and exercise studies, podcaster, speaker and author.

1:50Tara has helped hundreds of women feel badass and confident by teaching them how to lift weights and get strong, healthy, and empowered.

1:58Tara teaches women to take up space and to stop apologizing for their bodies.

2:03Specializing in fitness for fertility, prenatal and postnatal fitness, she loves helping moms go from hot mess to hot mom.

2:11Tara is passionate about health and fitness and strives to constantly improve herself and better help her clients.

2:18So welcome, Tara.

2:18I'm so glad you're here.

2:19Thanks so much for having me.

2:21Yeah, I'm like proud of you.

2:23I feel like hearing all those announcements.

2:24You have a lot going on.

2:26I love it.

2:27Thank you.

2:28Yeah, definitely have a lot going on and it's all really fun and exciting.

2:33yeah, it's, it's.

2:35It's great when you love what you do, isn't it?

2:38Yeah, super great.

2:40Yeah, it's just like that old adage, like you feel like you never work, right?

2:44Because you just have so much fun doing what you do.

2:47So when you get to serve other people, right?

2:50I mean, I still feel like I work sometimes, but Totally, like there's like the admin side of it for sure, yeah, but you know, that's that's the stuff that you delegate, right?

3:02Yes, a huge fan of like delegating and learning to say no and setting boundaries like love that stuff.

3:11Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

3:13, cool.

3:15So, you know, I always start my episodes the same way, and that is by asking my guests to tell me their origin story.

3:22So how is it that you came to be a fitness instructor for prenatal and postpartum women?

3:29Yeah, so my story is long and emotional,, but I will share it.

3:36I've had so many like changes throughout my career.

3:40so I grew up a little fat kid, and I got made fun of a lot and bullied as little fat kids tend to do.

3:48and by the way, a note on that, I use fat as like a neutral descriptor.

3:52I'm not like layering that word with judgment.

3:56I was just a child living in a larger body and society did not love that.

4:01So, as I grew up, I actually ended up in the wrong class in college.

4:06I was in a class called Sports Fitness Techniques.

4:09And at the time, I was like a psychology major.

4:11So I have no idea how I ended up in that.

4:13The internet was like, you know, not great back then.

4:17, that was the universe stepping in for divine intervention, is what that was.

4:21Yeah, right?

4:22So that's how I see it as well.

4:23It's like that course changed my life.

4:26because one day.

4:26My professor was like standing on his desk, like shouting about the Krebs cycle and target training zone, and me not knowing anything about fitness, was sitting there like, What is this guy doing?

4:39He's so passionate about this.

4:41And it like piqued my interest.

4:43so I ended up like changing my major.

4:45I majored in health fitness and exercise studies.

4:48Exercise and sports science is what we called it back then.

4:52And then I actually transferred to a different school, because it had a better program and also it didn't have any snow.

4:58I went to college in Hawaii, and it was every bit as amazing as it sounds.

5:04and then once I graduated, I'm from Maryland, so I moved back to Maryland, which is a questionable decision.

5:11Like, why leave Hawaii if you don't have to?

5:13, but I did, and then I decided to go to grad school, out in Arizona, and I majored in human movement with an emphasis in sports conditioning because my goal was to be a strength coach, right?

5:28Like, work with professional teams, collegiate teams, things like that to like make better athletes out of everyone.

5:34, so the reason I got into fitness and training was, one, my professor was exciting, and excited about it, but I also had terrible body image, right?

5:46I grew up, you know, getting teased and bullied and made fun of.

5:51and when I got to college, I was very active child my whole life, right?

5:56when I got to college, I met someone who was like, You should be a personal trainer.

5:59And I was like, OK, that's a good idea.

6:01And like, that's about how much thought I gave it.

6:04I was kind of like, yes.

6:06OK, the secret to like never being overweight again is to like be a personal trainer.

6:11Then I will just be like guaranteed to be like super fit for my whole life, which spoiler alert, that's definitely not how it worked out.

6:18, but I actually got into it for the wrong reasons, right?

6:23I got into it thinking I would just be like, you know, a super ripped goddess for the rest of my life.

6:29and then once I was in it, I realized I love helping other people.

6:33And so many times I see people walk into the gym and it's uncomfortable, right?

6:38It's a scary place for some people.

6:40It's dark and dingy, and the music is loud and it's dirty, and people are grunting and Sweating and weights are clanging.

6:48Like, I completely understand how this could be kind of a scary place to enter.

6:54and then you go in and you don't really know, like the hierarchy of like, well, who has the right of way and who gets to use what machines and, you know, things like that.

7:04So it's hard to keep going once you've made the decision to be in there until you learn how it kind of works, right?

7:12I don't drink coffee, so going to Starbucks is like super overwhelming for me because I don't understand the sizing.

7:19I don't understand the difference between all the coffees.

7:22I usually like walk in and I'm like, and find something like really quick off the menu and get out as quickly as possible because it's a place that I'm unfamiliar with in general.

7:33Right?

7:33The gym is that place for so many people.

7:37so once I got into it, I realized I actually love this.

7:40I love taking people by the hand and kind of guiding them through the gym and getting them comfortable there, and helping them on their journey, right?

7:50But I still had this like lingering thought that I wanted to be a strength and conditioning coach.

7:55so I left personal training.

7:57I left teaching group fitness, and I decided to go work at a university.

8:02So I spent almost 10 years working at, Navy, right here in my home.

8:07Town of all places, which was amazing.

8:10Loyola University, in Baltimore and the University of Maryland in Baltimore as well, and a private facility type place.

8:17And it was great.

8:19I learned a lot and I loved the athletes, but it definitely wasn't where I felt like I was at home.

8:26You know, like the career was good, the pay was bad, the hours were bad.

8:31And I started thinking like, hey, I'm at a point in my life where I want to start a family, right?

8:36I want to have a career, but also not just my career.

8:40I want more than this.

8:42and with the pay scale that I was at, that wasn't feasible.

8:46Then with the commute time that I was at, that wasn't feasible.

8:50and eventually I Quit my job as a strength coach.

8:54I started working at the gym that I still currently work at, and I bought a house all in the same day.

9:00so it was a crazy weekend.

9:05And when I started at the gym, you know, some of my like body image fears kind of crept back in.

9:11Like I don't look like a typical personal trainer, right?

9:14I'm a plus size human being.

9:17what if people won't buy training from me because they're like, Oh my God, she's overweight.

9:21Like, what could she possibly know?

9:22, and I was worried about if people would want to listen to what I had to say, even though I had all this education and like 15 certifications and, you know, two decades of experience, I was nervous.

9:35, and turns out my fears were unfounded, and then I started working at the gym and I very quickly became busy.

9:42And I love what I do, and I love helping other people, on this journey.

9:48And where I've kind of shifted over the years is back in the 90s and early 2000s, we were all about shrinking our bodies, right?

9:56We just wanted to be smaller, smaller, smaller, smaller, and no small was small enough.

10:01and it never really vibed with me.

10:04Because I feel like people are good how they are, you know, like everybody's so interesting and everybody has something that's beautiful about them and, you know, everybody's worthy regardless of what they look like.

10:17And so, Kind of like when Sir Mix a lot came along with Baby Got Back and JLo took, you know, an extra limo for her booty to the, to the Grammys that one year.

10:28Like, I feel like that's where all of this started kind of like percolating, you know, Shania, I mean, Shanaya, Shakira's hips don't lie, like, that's where this all started.

10:39And now that society has fully embraced, like being comfortable in your own skin and being curvy is OK.

10:47, that's when I felt like my time in the fitness industry began to shine, because I'm not gonna like tell people they have to be smaller.

10:58I'm not gonna tell them that they have to earn their food.

11:01I'm not gonna tell them that they're unworthy of literally anything.

11:05I'm just gonna help them have better habits to get healthier.

11:10And so when that started, I had been trying to get pregnant for a few years already at that point, probably 3 years.

11:20and I started researching anything I could possibly do to improve my chances of conception.

11:26Because it had been a long, long, long journey.

11:29and I realized there was a lot of things I was doing wrong in the gym that weren't allowing me to get pregnant.

11:35And then, of course, I discovered I had polycystic ovaries, so really the gym had nothing to do with me not getting pregnant.

11:41But there were a lot.

11:43I was like, I was like writing down a note.

11:45What were you doing in the gym that made you not get pregnant?

11:47And like next sentence, you like negated.

11:49I love it.

11:50Yeah, so, the answer to that question is like if you do really high intensity exercise, think things like orange theory and F45, like high intensity interval type training.

12:01you can actually like spike some of your hormone levels like cortisol, things like that, that will actually inhibit you from conceiving if you're doing that on like a super regular basis.

12:12, so it's not the case for everyone, right?

12:15Like, obviously there are women who go to F45 that totally get pregnant.

12:20but if you're doing this over and over and over, and you're especially if you're on like a calorie restricted diet, like really hindering your chances of conceiving.

12:29It didn't turn out to be the case for me.

12:30Mine was just like the Lord blessed me with crap ovaries.

12:34so, That wasn't my scenario, but I do see that a lot at the gym where women are just like going so hard.

12:42Usually because a doctor has told them like, oh, you're trying to get pregnant, lose a few pounds before you get pregnant.

12:47It'll help your chances of conceiving, which may or may not be true, right?

12:51Like, we don't often look at anything other than BMI.

12:56When it comes to health, and BMI is like absolute trash and shouldn't be used at all.

13:02but doctors will look at BMI and go, oh, you're a few, you know, points high on the BMI scale, lose some weight.

13:07And they don't even consider, like, hey, what are you already doing?

13:10Are you already doing some high intensity intervals?

13:13Are you already lifting?

13:13Are you already walking?

13:14What's your diet look like?

13:15They don't ask those questions.

13:17They just say, lose some weight, and then we all go, OK, I better ramp it up, regardless of where my previous level was.

13:24So a lot of those women that I see will already be exercising at a modern.

13:29or a high level, and then add more onto it.

13:32And then that stress cycle that happens, you know, we spike some of those hormones and then conception just doesn't occur.

13:40And oftentimes, if we scale it back and we're like, OK, we're going to do moderate weightlifting like twice a week, and I want you to go for walks after work.

13:47Like people can see all the time like that.

13:50, but during that time, I learned all of this because I dove deep into the research on it, and read everything I possibly could, because I was trying to get pregnant.

14:03and then eventually I did, not because of any sort of workout that I did, but I went to Shady Grove, which worked wonders for me.

14:11and during that time frame, I also was learning all about prenatal fitness.

14:17and so it was really like inspired by my own story, like, hey, I want to learn how to safely do this stuff during pregnancy.

14:24I don't want to stop exercising because I'm pregnant.

14:28So where do we go from here?

14:29And that's kind of like where I learned most of it.

14:34So it's been a wild ride.

14:35I went from very much like steeped in diet culture to now I'm like a weight neutral personal trainer who rallies against diet culture.

14:43Thank you so much for sharing your story.

14:45I, I saw myself in so much of it, and I'm sure listeners did as well.

14:52you know, first question though, have you told that professor how much his class changed your life?

14:56, no, I haven't because I don't think he's around anymore.

15:02Like back in the olden days when I should have said something, like he was already pretty aged, and now I'm like, he must be like 90 years old if he's still around.

15:13But he actually still holds like a world record in like deadlifting and squatting.

15:20So like, dude was strong.

15:22Wow, yeah, I mean, if he was that passionate about it, that's cool that he like walked the walk too.

15:27Totally.

15:28awesome.

15:29So, By the way, I I really liked a lot of your story.

15:33I love that you said the BMI scale is trash.

15:36I was on the other end of that.

15:37I was like the scrawny kid that could not gain weight for the life of me.

15:41And every doctor's appointment, I would dread it because they would pull out the freaking scale and they'd be like, Here's you.

15:46And I'm like, I eat literally more than anyone I know.

15:49It's just metabolism.

15:51Right.

15:53And, and, and it's just like, oh, I like cringe every time.

15:58Every time, man, like weight stigma goes both ways.

16:01Like, we hear a lot about it from people that are in larger bodies because we encounter it all the time.

16:08but people in smaller bodies also do too, and it's like never really appropriate to comment on how someone's body looks, you know, we get so caught up.

16:20And it's also none of our business what other people think of our bodies.

16:25Yeah, like there's no real reason for them to share that with us.

16:29Yeah, and I mean, when you're when you're younger and before we probably knew better, these are like people of authority, right?

16:35A doctor.

16:37It's like, OK, they must know what they're talking about, but it's like, no, I just totally would roll my eyes every time.

16:42It's like, OK, like.

16:43Yeah, the BMI scale is so frustrating because it was developed by this guy in France, I believe, named Quele in the 1700s.

16:52So this is like a long time ago.

16:55He only used white males who were of sound mind and who were not frail.

17:00So he has eliminated everyone except for like healthy white males.

17:06And even then, it was never meant to be like a body fat analytic.

17:10It was meant to look at like this whole huge conglomerate of factors.

17:15And somehow our like current medical system is like latched on to that as if it's like the gold standard.

17:21Like, it doesn't take any more effort hardly to get one of those scales that does body fat percentage.

17:26So like when you go to the doctor, they could actually give you a fairly accurate body fat percentage, and then there might be something to say about it.

17:35But a BMI is like worthless.

17:37If you want to pass your BMI test, you know, you like cut your leg off.

17:41I think all of us would agree that's like not at all healthy, you know, unless you have to for some medical reason, right?

17:47But to just fit within the scale, you know, or like, I don't even know how you would make it heavier, like grow your hair longer, right?

17:55So that your BMI goes up just a little bit, you know, like, it's so silly.

18:00It's so silly that that's a metric we're using.

18:04I feel like there's so much like that that's so antiquated, just like, not even in just the medical industry, just in life, right?

18:09Where it's like, I knew it was from men, but I didn't know it was white males only in a certain age bracket from the 1700s.

18:18That's just so wild.

18:19Yeah, that makes no sense.

18:23OK, so.

18:25You also work with postpartum women, so Why, why postpartum?

18:31Did you personally struggle with losing weight after or body image after pregnancy?

18:36Because like, I know that's such a big thing that so many women struggle with.

18:41I know for me, and by the way, I relate to your story too, because it took me 8 years to get pregnant and I had to do IVF a bunch of times, which also.

18:50Made me gain a bunch of weight, which made me feel super insecure before, like, for for like 3 years before I ever got pregnant right from all the hormones you feel crazy from all the hormones.

19:02Oh God, and then you're gaining weight and they're like, don't gain any more weight or we can't do the surgeries and stuff and it's like OK, well, I wouldn't be gaining weight if I wasn't being pumped full of all these hormones, you know, yeah, I completely understand.

19:16It's like, it is a crazy journey and I just want to give like love, support, and good vibes to everyone on that path cause it is a roller coaster.

19:25Yeah.

19:26But I remember having so much fear about getting pregnant because of body image stuff, which is like an embarrassing thing to say out loud, but it's, it's so true and it's, I think so many people feel that way.

19:38So, so like, what was your own postpartum journey like?

19:41And then, you know, I want, I want to hear also like.

19:45I guess like how women that you've worked with typically feel in their postpartum weight journey.

19:51Yeah, postpartum is super hard and I don't care if you had the easiest pregnancy of all time, and your baby just like, you know, flew out without any pain.

19:59Like postpartum is another wild ride.

20:04I am newish into my motherhood journey.

20:07My son will be 4 next month.

20:10so like, obviously there's mamas that are way more experienced out there to me, but I have This like sneaky suspicion that like the entire motherhood is a wild roller coaster.

20:21It's like a little scary to me.

20:24you know, like I think journey was crazy, you know, labor, pregnancy, labor and delivery can be a little crazy.

20:30Postpartum was really wild.

20:33and then toddlerhood is has nothing on the rest of that.

20:37And then it's like, oh my gosh, what if everything's like this?

20:42so my postpartum was a little bit different than many women's journey because it was during the pandemic.

20:49So I was pregnant when the pandemic hit, and all of a sudden it was like my husband couldn't come to any appointments with me.

20:57, we were like literally prepping for a home birth in case our hospital shut down.

21:04thank God that didn't happen cause I can't imagine having to have a baby and then clean up your own house, you know, like, don't put me down for that.

21:13also, not to mention, if I had given birth at home, my baby and I both would have died.

21:19so definitely not something that I wanted to go through, and luckily we didn't have to, so.

21:26, postpartum was a little bit stressful, particularly because we had a rough start, right?

21:33I just said that, my child and I both would have died if we had given birth at home.

21:38and it's because he was born not breathing.

21:41and it is likely that that Happened because I was misdiagnosed during labor due to weight stigma.

21:51It's a whole story that I will not bore you with, but like the cliff notes are, my blood pressure spiked a little bit high during labor.

21:59I was having like an unmedicated.

22:02Labor at that point.

22:03and I was laying on my arm where the blood pressure cuff was, which you should never do that if you're getting your blood pressure taken.

22:10and of course, I was in pain, right?

22:12Like labor is painful.

22:13So, my blood pressure was a little bit high, and they took one look at me and they were like, oh my gosh, you are old and fat.

22:18, you know, you are definitely having preeclampsia, and I was like, dude, I've had perfect blood pressure my whole life.

22:26I literally worked out my entire pregnancy, like, let's hold off for now.

22:31and it got to the point where I wanted an epidural.

22:33And, they had like a nurse who, it was her first day, give me the epidural, which is fine.

22:39Like everybody's got to learn somewhere.

22:41But she ended up scraping the inside of my urethra with the, catheter.

22:46So I was bleeding and it didn't really hurt, right?

22:49Like labor's uncomfortable.

22:50So what's the one more thing, right?

22:52I didn't even hardly notice what was happening down there, but it made the bag of urine that's like hanging on the side.

22:58of the bed looked like it was brown, even though it was blood in there and not protein.

23:04So they didn't test.

23:06They didn't go like, Oh, let me take the strip and dip it in there and see if this is protein or blood or what is this.

23:12they just said, Oh my God, it's protein.

23:13You need all these drugs to prevent you from having like strokes and seizures.

23:17And I was like, Well, yeah, shit, I don't want that.

23:20Yeah, give me the drugs.

23:21I don't want to have a seizure or whatever.

23:23, so they did.

23:25And in my opinion, that is what caused my son to be born, not breathing.

23:31they do not agree with that assessment, and I'm not a doctor, so like, I don't really know, but that is my, suspicion based on a little bit of reading that I've done on the subject.

23:42So anyway, he was born not breathing and got whisked straight to NICU.

23:46It was fine.

23:46He was only there for a couple of days and he was breathing on his own within like half an hour or so.

23:51, like, everything worked out OK, and he is a vibrant, healthy 3 year old at this point.

23:57but it was a little bit traumatic and then being the pandemic, like we couldn't go in and out, you know, we were like stuck in that room there for like the duration.

24:07, and then when we got home, it was like too scary to have anybody over.

24:13Like I told my mom she couldn't come unless she isolated for two weeks, and she like showed up and mentioned like on the front porch that she had like seen friends for lunch like the next day and And I was like, Well, you can't come in if you were with your friends yesterday.

24:29And she was just like, Oh, but like it was just for a minute.

24:32And I'm like, I have like a medically fragile infant here.

24:35Like we're not risking it.

24:36Like, sorry.

24:38So the village was like nonexistent at that point.

24:43And I, I personally feel like I dealt with some like postpartum anxiety, but my doctor was kind of just like, yeah, you're a mom.

24:51Now you have anxiety, like life is anxious now.

24:55so it wasn't really well dealt with, and I remember feeling like I just didn't have my life together.

25:04You know, like, strangely, I will say, postpartum, the baby weight that I had fell off immediately, like within a month I was down to my like pre-pregnancy weight, which was completely bizarre and unexpected because I'm one of those people where if I look at food, I will gain weight, But I, I really like thrived physically through my pregnancy and postpartum time, but mentally, man, it was crazy.

25:35And you know, you do have all these things changing with your body, like, you know, for me, my breast milk would leak out like all the time.

25:44So I would be sleeping all night and then the instant I would wake up before I even open my eyes, my shirt would go like and just be soaked.

25:53It was just like, what the heck?

25:56You know, one time I was out in the grocery store and I heard a baby start crying and all of a sudden my milk just let down and like dripped on the floor and I was like, oh my gosh, I'm like leaving bodily fluids on the floor.

26:08Like, how can I trust my body now?

26:13like a particularly funny story about that is I woke up one day, the baby was sleeping in his bassinet at the bottom of the bed, still asleep, and I had to pee so bad.

26:21, so I like got up, didn't put my glasses on.

26:25I'm super blind, by the way, without glasses or contacts, and I went to pee.

26:30You know, peeing was a struggle postpartum.

26:33I felt like I had to pee super bad, but it just dripped out like a leaky faucet instead of like a fire hose.

26:38I would like listen to my husband pee normally and get like ragey because of it.

26:42So I finally peed.

26:46And then came back to my bedroom and my husband goes, Babe, don't move.

26:50And I was like, right.

26:52And he's like, there's a spider.

26:53And like, OK, I don't love spiders, but I'm not terrified of spiders.

26:58But like, I couldn't see anything.

26:59So I'm like, oh my gosh, where is it?

27:01And he's like, it's right there.

27:02And I'm like, Where?

27:03I don't know where that is.

27:05Like, I am blind, sir.

27:07and I didn't know if it was.

27:08Like descending on me, if it was descending on the baby.

27:10Like I didn't know where this spider was.

27:14and so I just like panicked.

27:16And while I'm sitting there bursting into tears, I peed myself somehow, and my milk let down.

27:23And I was just kind of like, Oh.

27:27You're like leaking out of every end like anything that could have let fluids out like basically did, and I was just kind of like, oh my gosh.

27:35So I like go back to the bathroom, put my contacts in, clean myself up, and I come back in and it's like the world's smallest spider that was like halfway down the wall, nowhere near me or him or the baby.

27:48And I was just kind of like, really?

27:53I love that story.

27:54Like when working with clients, right?

27:57Everybody comes because, you know, they want to feel strong again.

28:01They don't really feel strong in their bodies, even though, like, your body has just done this amazing thing, right?

28:09Like you've literally grown an entire human, you know, you're probably making some of the food for that human with your own body, which is like a miracle.

28:20, you know, you're also surviving.

28:24You're like living your life, you're still getting up, you're back to work at some point, right?

28:30If you're, if you're a working mom, of course, Well, all moms are working moms, but if you're working outside the home for money kind of mom, then like you're back to work and society kind of suspects us to just like expects us to just jump right back in and be who we were before we had this baby.

28:49But really, like pieces of our baby.

28:53Stay with us forever.

28:54Like you are so changed.

28:57The second that that baby comes out, like you will never ever be the same.

29:02I would argue that you will never ever be the same the second that like conception happens even.

29:07but you'll never be the same human, and that's totally OK.

29:12And wonderful, but I feel like society just kind of goes like, well, you should still be the same.

29:18You should still look the same, still dress the same, still act the same, your self-care should still be the same.

29:24why are you changing, right?

29:26And then we as the mothers feel like, oh my gosh, I'm failing at home, right?

29:30Like, am I a piece of crap for putting my kid in daycare during a pandemic?

29:34Like, he might die because I feel like I have to go to work, right?

29:38, which, of course, it's OK to do that, right?

29:42Like you can make your own choices and like whatever happens happens, but at some point, like, It's a decision you have to make, right?

29:52or like, oh, do I quit my job and stay home with my child, and now we don't have enough money for the bills.

30:00Right, so it's a lose-lose.

30:01You feel like you're either failing at home or failing at work or failing at both, which I think is where many women are.

30:08, and by default we're a lot of like the decision makers, so we're the ones doing the research on, you know, everything, like what a safe sleep for an infant look like?

30:20What about the vaccine schedule?

30:22What about, you know, feeding?

30:24How do we get them started eating regular food?

30:27You know, I think it's really worth if I could like make a recommendation for anyone who's pregnant, like have a conversation with your partner before the baby comes about like who's researching what things.

30:38, because it takes so much mental load for us to like research that and to like stay on top of it, even like buying diapers.

30:47How do you know when your baby's gonna be out of diapers?

30:49Like, somebody has to like take that task on and go, we only have like 6 left.

30:54I should probably order another box, you know?

30:57Well, probably you should have ordered it like 10 diapers ago, but At that point, like.

31:04Somebody's gotta carry the mental load, and if in our culture, mostly it's moms, and it's hard because we're not used to also caring for another tiny human that plays the guy.

31:16I always say my son as a toddler played this game of how can I kill myself every day, and I had to play the game of how can I prevent him from killing himself, and it was absolutely exhausting and draining.

31:27Like everything you just said is just so real.

31:30Like it is just so freaking real.

31:34Like the decisions are also like really terrifying.

31:38Like I, oh my God, when you said the vaccine schedule it's just like, like.

31:44Yeah, I mean, and it's like, you know, you want to do the best for your kid and you're like, OK, all this research tells me I'm injecting poison into him and hurt him.

31:54All this research tells me I'm preventing him from getting these horrible diseases and I'm like, be saving his life like.

32:02You know, yeah, no, it's just it's so real.

32:06It's so hard.

32:08I actually want to do a podcast on like being like scientifically literate, because many of us, we're like getting our information from social media.

32:20You know, we're not like watching the news and like reading, you know, like research abstracts and stuff.

32:27We're like hoping other people read that stuff for us and then write like a little sound bite that they share on social media that we can go like, oh, yes, that is great, that's what I'm gonna do, right?

32:38Because we're busy managing like the rest of our entire family's life.

32:43, so it is super challenging, to be the one researching the stuff and then making the decisions and then staying on top of it.

32:52And at the same time, we're like, am I doing enough?

32:56You know, I'll tell you another story.

32:57This is how, so I wrote a book called Hot Mess to Hot Mom, Transformational tools for thriving after Childbirth and Beyond.

33:04And this is how the book came to be.

33:07It was the morning of my son's first birthday.

33:10, so the pandemic was still in full swing, right?

33:13It's like July 2021.

33:15Pandemic is still brutal, and I decided that because I felt like we missed out on anything maternity related, like pictures and a baby shower.

33:26And anything like that.

33:27Like we didn't have any of that because people were like dying over FaceTime on their iPads, right?

33:33So we were like, well, I guess we'll do without and we'll survive.

33:37but I was like, I don't want my child to miss out on important things now that he's here, right?

33:42I can be disappointed that he was in utero and didn't get these things, but I'm not going to let him be disappointed, even though in retrospect, a one year old would not have cared.

33:52To me, I cared.

33:53So I planned this big party for him.

33:55We were gonna have all of our friends over for his first birthday, and I was standing in the shower, listening to him bang on the door and cry and try to get in and be mad that he couldn't be in the shower with me while I was showering, and I'm sitting there thinking like, OK, so we're gonna put the food on the countertop.

34:16I hope I ordered enough.

34:17Wait, is the caterer bring bringing plates or did I need to get plates?

34:20I hope, I hope they're bringing plates, cause I definitely don't have enough and I don't have enough, you know, real plates for everybody.

34:27So, well, I hope that'll be fine.

34:29, and then I was like, I can't believe the baker of of his cake misspelled his name.

34:35My son's name is Maverick, and she like left out the V, so the cake said like, Happy birthday Mayrick, and I was like, what?

34:44You know, and I'm like, at the time, I'm like, oh my gosh, how do you mess up his first birthday cake?

34:50Like, get it together.

34:52And I thought, like, probably at some point I'll think it's funny and laugh about it, which we've reached that point.

34:57It is funny and not a big deal.

34:59But at the time, I was like, oh my gosh, I messed that up, even though it was that me making the cake, it was not.

35:05I ordered it from a bakery.

35:06It wasn't my mistake, but I internalized that as like my failure.

35:11And I noticed like, oh man, I need to buy more body wash, you know, add that to the grocery list.

35:17speaking of groceries, I wonder if I need to get this, you know, like my mind was just kind of racing there in the shower, and I looked down and I realized I hadn't shaved my legs in like, who knows how long.

35:29And I was like looking at my legs and I'm like, oh my gosh, I have got to shave these things, but this is gonna be like a multi-step process at this point because nobody's razor is like strong enough to deal with the Sasquatch situation we have going on here.

35:45And that's when I realized I was like, girl, your child is a year old, you have to get your shit together.

35:52And I was like, OK, what does that look like?

35:56And what I really wanted was I wanted to be having my life together enough that he had the mother that he deserved, you know, and I wanted to feel like, I I just had a checklist of like, what would make me feel like I had my life together.

36:13Like, man, if I could work out again, you know, my body didn't feel right postpartum until I was like 6 or 8 months postpartum.

36:21You know, my pelvic floor wasn't super damaged during labor.

36:25Like I had a little tear, but it was just a little one, you know, and yet it took me a long time to feel like my guts weren't gonna fall out every time I moved, right?

36:35And that's OK.

36:37This like 6 week benchmark of like, you have to be exercising at 6 weeks.

36:41By the way, you're open for business at 6 weeks is crazy, you know, like if we're doing our mom as a disservice here.

36:51But for me, like being able to work out again was on the list of like, how am I gonna feel, right?

36:56Am I gonna feel like I have my life a little bit together and that I'm doing me things, right?

37:04Like Tara is a person who exercises regularly, but Tara as a mom was just like the birth giver and milk maker and wasn't exercising at all.

37:13You know, so I wanted to exercise.

37:16I wanted to make sure I was getting enough sleep.

37:18I wanted to eat something that wasn't carry out most nights of the week.

37:22I wanted to like have some time away and have my own hobbies and, you know, like, Make sure I got his like, you know, Roth IRA or his 529 set up.

37:34I wanted to get life insurance for him.

37:36I wanted to get like my will and testament done for me so that if something were to happen, like, these are horrible things that none of us, especially new moms, do not want to think about that.

37:46But I can only imagine how much worse a tragedy is if you don't have any way to pay for it.

37:54Right, or if you don't have any plans, like, you know, you and your husband die in a car accident, where does your kid go?

38:00Like, That'll get messy if you haven't laid that out.

38:04So for me, I felt like, dude, I just need a checklist of like, how to feed myself, how to nourish myself, how to nourish my baby, how to make myself feel like I'm a human again and not just The like milk maker birth giver.

38:20and so I went online and like researched all this after his party.

38:23I was like, all right, let me Google, like, new mom checklist, and nothing came up really other than like, here's what to buy, which is also important, you know, there were definitely a few baby items that like made my life way easier, but it didn't really exist in the form that I thought it should exist in.

38:41So I kind of thought like, gosh, somebody should write that.

38:44And then a few months later I was like, maybe it should be me.

38:49and then I had a meeting with my business coach and she was like, what is your perfect day look like?

38:53And I was like sitting on the beach, not being around humans.

38:58And she was like, Oh, so you need to be a writer.

39:00And I was like, Well, I do kind of have an idea that I've been thinking about.

39:05And she was like, Yes, let's do this.

39:08so I pitched it to a publisher, and she was like, I love this idea.

39:12Everybody needs this freaking book, dude.

39:14None of us as new moms know what we're doing.

39:16None of us feel like ourselves anymore.

39:19we all love our children like beyond recognition, and we have no idea how we even have the capacity to love something that hard.

39:26, and it's like a little scary for us, but like we're here for it, but we still deserve to be us as a separate human being.

39:35, and she was like, but you're not an expert in all these areas.

39:40She's like, you gotta write about body image, you gotta write about fitness, you know, you can do like an introduction, a closing, you know, chapter, whatever, but you need to have like a dietitian talking about fueling your body.

39:52You need to have a sleep specialist, you know, talking about how to make sure that you as the mother are getting enough sleep when your baby may not be sleeping, right?

40:02You need to have someone write about doing like your estate planning.

40:06You know, you don't know about that.

40:07And I was like, shit, I definitely don't know about that.

40:11so I basically went and recruited all these people to help me.

40:15Most of these were people who I used during my postpartum phase, You know, at one point, I had a lady write a chapter and she is, like a sexiness coach.

40:27That's what I call her.

40:28Her actual titles like yoga therapist or something, but, she's like a sexiness coach, and I went to her, I I went to my doctor actually and I was like, Hey, so my libido is like gone.

40:39When does that come back?

40:41And she was like, Oh, like when your kid's in college.

40:44And then she looked at her notes and she was like, Never mind, you'll be in menopause by then, so like, never.

40:50And I was like, this is terrible.

40:52I used to enjoy like being physical with people, you know, like, I don't want to like never enjoy that again.

40:59And she was just like, oh.

41:01Yeah, welcome to motherhood.

41:03And I don't think that's like an acceptable answer.

41:07so I went and like looked for other people to help me with this kind of thing, right?

41:11And I found Julie and I was like, Julie, you gotta help me.

41:15And she gave me the most bizarre advice that somehow totally works, and I'll tell you because every new mom should like know this if they're struggling with libido, once you're ready for like sexy stuff, not like instantly.

41:28, she was like, every time you touch or see water, I want you to think of like sexy stuff.

41:35And I was like, like what?

41:38Like, I wash dishes like 48 times a day.

41:41And she was like, Yeah.

41:43She was like, OK, so you turn the water on and you put your hands in it and you're like, Oh, the water's so soft and it's warm, you know, and it's dripping on my hands.

41:53And I was just kind of like, OK.

41:58I don't know about this.

42:00or like in the shower, you're like getting wet and touching your body and just feeling like sexy, even though you're like leaking milk and you're tired and your leg hair's 4 inches long and there's a screaming baby in the background.

42:14Like, I was kind of like, OK, this isn't exactly the advice that I was hoping for.

42:20But girl, I'm telling you, it somehow worked.

42:23I don't know.

42:24I can't explain it, but somehow I was just like, dang, I, OK, I could be into this.

42:30How long, how long did it take to work?

42:34I would say like within a week, I was like.

42:39OK.

42:40You know, because when you're breastfeeding, like, it, it is, it's like painful, actually.

42:48Yeah, breastfeeding, I feel like is by far the hardest part of life.

42:52No, I mean down there it is painful like to have sex while you're breastfeeding in my.

42:58I also experienced that.

43:00Although, to be fair, like my, I got mastitis 4 times in 6 months, which was awful.

43:07I hate mastitis.

43:08It was like the worst thing ever.

43:11and every time I got it, it would like drop my supply.

43:14So I was like done breastfeeding by like 7 months.

43:17, I was pumping like 4 hours a day to get like 3 ounces, and I was finally like, what are, what, what are we doing?

43:24Like 99% of my child's diet is not breast milk, and yet I'm sitting here for 4 hours a day trying to like make this happen.

43:32so like for me, I didn't do penetration for like a long time, you know, we did other stuff, but not that because it was just very unpleasant down there, as you said.

43:41, but I will say the like water thing really worked within like a week.

43:47I at least was interested in considering it.

43:52Before that it was like, oh, you again?

43:55God.

43:57Like you don't touch that.

43:58That's for the baby.

44:00All right, like I'm over this, thank you.

44:02I'm still recovering from many things here.

44:05But So I I love all your stories.

44:09You're so real and relatable and like everything.

44:11I mean, I didn't even get to comment on your birth story and like how freaking scary and terrifying and traumatic that is.

44:20and just, you know, everything you've been saying, I've been kind of like writing down little things and it just, you're just like so hitting it on the head, like every time.

44:29, I really want to get to a little bit of like the fitness and stuff since we only have like 15 minutes left.

44:38you, you mentioned something that piqued my interest and I'm sure like everyone else's ears perked up.

44:45You dropped your pre-pregnancy weight in like a month, drop to your pre-pregnancy weight.

44:51What did you do?

44:52What happened and how are you coaching, like, what's, what's your advice for women in postpartum who are trying to get down to their pre-pregnancy weight, because let's be real, like, yes, we can tell people they are worthy and they are amazing and they are incredible and interesting and all these things, but sometimes, People just want to get to their pre-pregnancy weight so they can fit into their damn clothing, right?

45:14So like, so like, how do you, what, what advice do you have for women and how did you do it?

45:20So nobody's gonna like this answer at all, but I didn't do anything.

45:24I just like survived, you know, the first month or so that my son was born, it was just like figuring it out mode, you know, like, I just stayed home a lot, because it was pandemic, right?

45:40So I just stayed in my house a lot and I slept a lot.

45:43Like I will say I had a miracle child when it comes to sleeping, He was sleeping through the night by like 3 weeks.

45:52So like I got plenty of rest, which I think was crucial into like getting my healing back on track, to getting my weight back where it was.

46:03I think that like the amount of rest I was able to get was absolutely essential.

46:08And it wasn't necessarily like all in a row, but like, you know, I would wake up at midnight to feed him.

46:17And then he would just go right back down by like 12:20 and I'd sleep until like 4 a.m. and then wake up and feed him again and he was back down by 4:15, like it was really, really easy for me to do the sleeping thing.

46:32and diet wise, I found that breastfeeding made me like absolutely parched.

46:38Like it was almost uncanny.

46:40The second I would put my pumps on or if I was holding my baby, like the first, like, I was like, I need water.

46:48I'm dying.

46:49This is an emergency.

46:50I need water right now.

46:51Like it was, it was super bizarre.

46:54my husband actually bought me like a 40 ounce Yeti, and he was like, get that, yeah, you know.

47:01He was like, get that thing ready before you start pumping, cause I'm tired of bringing it to you, and I was like, oh.

47:07OK, I'm tired of feeding your child, but here we are.

47:11Yeah.

47:13So I drank an absurd amount of water and I've always enjoyed like fruits and vegetables.

47:20It was summertime, so like, yeah, we had a lot of fruits and veggies that we would just like munch on.

47:26we also had like a lot of snow cones, so I can't really say like, oh, we watched our diet.

47:31No, we didn't.

47:32, we just kind of ate what we wanted to.

47:35I do think not being on a solid schedule of like, this is breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

47:40Like I probably just didn't eat as many calories as I normally do because it wasn't like working.

47:46I would wake up and I would chill and just knowing that I could eat at any time.

47:52Made me go like, well, I don't need food yet.

47:54Like I just wasn't hungry for it.

47:56whereas like my day now is very like structured, right?

48:00I'm at the gym at like 7 a.m. so I make sure I eat before I go and then I don't get a break until like 1, so I eat like a big lunch cause I'm usually starving.

48:10and then I know I'm not gonna eat dinner again until like 6 or 7.

48:14So like I have larger meals on a regular schedule, whereas like being at home with a newborn, I was kind of just like, Not gonna eat yet.

48:22I'm not really hungry, like, oh, I'll get a string cheese and a piece of pineapple.

48:26Like I didn't do a great job of fueling my body and I think that's why I lost the weight very quickly.

48:34Yeah you're like, Yeah, I was like grazing.

48:38My like professional recommendations for new moms that are trying to like get back down to their body weight, would be like drink a massive amount of water, right?

48:47Priority number one.

48:49Priority number 1 is get enough sleep.

48:50Priority number 2 is drink a massive amount of water, and then priority number 3 would be like prioritize protein.

48:57so if that means like, oh, you'd have a protein shake a couple times a day, and that's like the bulk of your calories, like, great, you know, but getting that protein in is gonna keep you feeling full for longer.

49:10It's also gonna help you build muscle or maintain the muscle that you already have.

49:15, so that would be like really, really helpful.

49:20I love that advice, and it's, it's.

49:24It's so easy for someone to just drink another extra couple of glasses of water or something, right?

49:29It feels doable, it feels attainable.

49:32so what a good guideline for that is like half your body weight in ounces.

49:38and that's if you're not breastfeeding.

49:39If you're breastfeeding, like the amount that goes out should be the amount coming in plus your half your body weight in ounces.

49:47So if your baby is drinking 30 ounces a day, it should be half your body weight in ounces plus 30.

49:54That's really good to know.

49:55I also wouldn't stress yourself about that.

49:57Like if you're thirsty drink.

49:59Like breastfeeding you're you know you're thirsty.

50:01There's no doubt that you like want to be drinking something, and I would prioritize water in that case, because that's what breast milk is primarily like water, so, you know, make sure you're drinking lots of water and not a lot of like other drinks.

50:18Yeah.

50:20So what about, what about a, what's the best exercise to help lose the baby weight, to help lose the baby's stomach?

50:29you know, for me, like, it took me a long, it took for the 1st 6 weeks, like nothing changed on the scale.

50:35And I was like, what the?

50:37is going on because everyone's like, oh, just breastfeeding and it'll fall away.

50:41And then other people were like, if you breastfeed, you won't lose a pound.

50:43And I'm like, oh my God, I don't want to be the later group, right?

50:46The latter group.

50:47But I had a C-section and I think it was like that extra recovery time because once I hit 6 weeks.

50:53It started falling off really fast.

50:55And then the last two I've kind of been on a plateau.

50:57So I'm like, what's going to get me those last 9 pounds so I can fit into my clothes?

51:03Like, like what?

51:05Like the bad news is that like genetically we're kind of like predisposed to hang on to some of that weight until you are done breastfeeding.

51:13, and the reason for that is like if there were to be like a famine or something, your body will pull from that fat in order to make sure that you can still produce milk for your baby.

51:25so we're kind of like genetically predisposed to hang on to like a bit of it, right?

51:30Just in case of like emergencies.

51:34so after you quit breastfeeding, it is much easier to lose the fat.

51:37, I wouldn't say that's like a reason to stop your breastfeeding journey early, but like, know that it gets easier once your hormones are kind of back in action.

51:47For me, I had like wicked postpartum night sweats, while I was breastfeeding, and as soon as I stopped breastfeeding, those went away, which was awesome.

51:55, so, like it comes, but I really feel like new moms should prioritize strength training, and the reason for this is because it's gonna help prevent injuries.

52:08I was lucky enough to have a Duna stroller, which is like the best invention that's ever been invented for babies, where it's one of those infant car seats, but with the push of a button, wheels pop down and it turns into a stroller.

52:20So you don't have to like lug around that awkward infant car seat that's like 15 pounds plus you're like 10 pound baby in there, you know, and you're holding it off to the side.

52:31So now you're all like tilted and jacked at this weird angle, and I see like a huge amount of women that have like elbow issues, shoulder issues, and lower back issues from carrying that infant carrier, right?

52:44So,, doing some strength training to make sure that you're strong enough to meet the demands that your newborn places upon you, super, super essential.

52:56Yeah, I, my husband pulled his back twice carrying the beer with the baby in it.

53:02So that is so real.

53:04I've heard strength training also just kind of boost your metabolism overall to help lose the weight.

53:10Is that true?

53:11Yeah, absolutely.

53:13So muscle needs calories in order to maintain itself.

53:17Otherwise it'll just like atrophy over time, right?

53:21We just slowly like deteriorate.

53:23, and fat on the flip side doesn't need any calories to maintain itself.

53:28it's just like a Sentient, you know, substance that just is.

53:33And if you take in less calories, like you'll burn some, but it's the muscles that are doing the burning of the fat.

53:40So the more muscles you can have, the more fat you're gonna burn overall, the more calories you're gonna burn overall.

53:46, and I feel like I get this comment a lot that people are really worried about turning into like a bodybuilder or something.

53:55and like it takes so much work to build that much muscle and it usually takes a lot of like supplementation to do that.

54:03So, as a new mom, I would very much not worry about getting like too muscular.

54:08It also happens really gradually, so if you like look at your arms one day and you're like, oh, these are gross, they're muscular man arms.

54:16You just stop doing what you're doing and they'll go away within a week, you know.

54:21How many, how many days a week do you recommend doing strength training as a new mom?

54:25Twice.

54:27That's it.

54:27Twice a week for like 20 to 30 minutes is plenty.

54:31Wow, all right.

54:32, it has been such a pleasure to talk to you.

54:36I can't believe an hour is already up.

54:37I've been, I've had to put myself on mute because I've been like cracking up.

54:41You're hilarious and it's just so real.

54:44Like I feel like.

54:46You should be a stand-up comedian because it's just you're so relatable and just so many things like your story with the spider leaking out of your eyes and your nipples and peeing like to the last 3 weeks of my pregnancy, I had this like horrible cold and I was just, I had this horrible cough and every cough, I would just pee myself, every cough.

55:06And I firmly believe that like every pregnant woman ever should go to pelvic floor physical therapy, at least for like one or two sessions just to get evaluated.

55:16So there it's like pretty easy to stop like the pea sneeze, but none of us really talk about how to do it in case you're like experiencing that and you're like, oh my God, how do we stop it?

55:28look up the girl.

55:29Gone strong connection breath.

55:31She has a great video on how to do it.

55:34or I have it posted on my Instagram too.

55:36So, like just that one simple exercise could like fix the pea sneeze in many people.

55:43But I also very much recommend pelvic floor physical therapy because, yeah, I definitely like peed the couch more than once during pregnancy and that sucks.

55:51Yeah, I'm so thankful it hasn't happened to me postpartum, but I didn't have a vaginal birth.

55:56I had a C-section, so it's probably a big part of it.

55:59I know I have friends that still struggle with it and their kids are many years old.

56:03So I'll I'll give them a whole different set of things that you have to deal with now too, right?

56:10Like releasing that like scar tension and things like that.

56:13So definitely pelvic floor PT for everybody would be helpful.

56:17Yeah, scar tension is like a real thing for sure.

56:21OK, please, I'm sure everyone wants to connect with you.

56:25Where can they find you?

56:26What's your website?

56:27What's your social social media, all of that.

56:30Yeah, so I'm like very much most active on Instagram, and my Instagram is at Tara Deleon fitness, but there's like an underscore in between each word.

56:39So Tara_da_on_fitness.

56:44It's a terrible Instagram name.

56:46I should definitely have never picked that, knowing that I would be saying it out loud, but that's the world we live in.

56:53So definitely find me there.

56:56I don't have a website, believe it or not.

56:59Instagram is where you can get me for like everything.

57:02but if you're into like the weight neutral fitness and the intuitive eating type stuff, I have my own podcast called Well.

57:08rebranded.

57:10you can find it anywhere you like to listen to podcasts.

57:14essentially, it's me, a dietician, and a mental health therapist team up to talk about what is actual self-care and what's like diet culture and toxic positivity kind of run amok.

57:25so we're always chatting about interesting stuff on the pod.

57:28And then you can find my book on Amazon.

57:30I actually have like like a 12 week fitness program for postpartum in the book.

57:37the way I laid out the book was there was like funny stories like the spider stories in there, for example, and then And at the end of each chapter, there's a tool.

57:46So if you're too busy, you're too immersed in like the chaos of postpartum, you can skip the stories and just read the tool and apply that to your life like immediately.

57:56So I've got a whole workout in there if you want it.

58:00It's there for you.

58:01Awesome.

58:02So many great resources.

58:03Your podcast sounds awesome.

58:05Thank you so much, Tara.

58:07It was great to meet you and have this conversation and just feel very seen as a new mom myself.

58:13So I appreciate you.

58:15If you are listening, yeah, please send this to a new mom that you think could use it.

58:20Like, comment, share, subscribe.

58:22I will see you all in the next episode.

58:24Have a beautiful rest of your day.